5 Thoughts On Joseph Smith's Seer Stones

     In an effort to be more transparent, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints released photos of a stone that Joseph Smith is reported to have used to translate the Book of Mormon, referred to in the Mormon church as the seer stone.  According to LDS history, "Joseph placed...the seer stone in a hat, pressed his face into the hat to block out extraneous light, and read aloud the English words that appeared on the instrument.  The process brings to mind a passage from the Book of Mormon that speaks of God preparing "a stone, which shall shine forth in darkness unto light.""
     Historically, Joseph Smith was very aloof when it came to explaining the exact manner behind the method of his translation.  Whenever Joseph Smith was "pressed for specifics about the process of translation, Joseph repeated on several occasions that it had been done "by the power of God" and once added, "It was not intended to tell the world all the particulars of the coming forth of the book of Mormon.""   In fact, the only reason we have the details that we have today are because the scribes and people who worked with Joseph Smith spilled some things about the process.  And so while we don't know exactly how this stone worked, the scribes and witnesses have testified that it was indeed used in the process.
     With the release of the pictures of this seer stone, a lot of questions are being answered, a lot of Mormon doctrine is being learned, and a lot of LDS members are solidifying their faith.  This was honestly a good move for the LDS church.  As many of you know, the history of the church has been subject to a lot of scrutiny since it's establishment because of the lack of evidence.  As a result, its members have had little to no tangible evidence to defend their faith to opponents, other than their scriptures.  I truly hope, as do a lot of people, that the LDS church continues to release Mormon paraphernalia to the world.  With that being said, I have a few words on the matter.

1. It's Only A Picture

     Let's not forget that they didn't release the actual thing...only a picture of a thing.  If the goal is to be transparent, why not put it on display for the public to view?  This seems very odd to me.  If a claim can be substantiated in anyway, why would the LDS church not do everything they could to do it?  If they're worried about people stealing the thing, then why not just put it on display at a museum or something?  Tons of things are on display for us all to see, and a lot of these things are extremely priceless.  The Declaration of Independence, the fossil record, the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Mona Lisa, etc. and none of these have not been stolen (thanks to Nicholas Cage).
     This would be like if f I told the world that I saw a real life dragon, Smaug, in the flesh...or, more appropriately scales.  Obviously, the majority of people would call me a liar.  It would be extremely difficult to convince the world that I was telling the truth just on my word.  But, when pressed for evidence, I told them that I would show them my dragon egg.  After a short time, I return with a pristine 8.5x11 color photo of it.  Now, be honest: Would you believe me?  No.  Of course not!  A picture is not reliable proof...especially in today's world.

2. Make It Do Something!

     So, the thing that apparently did a thing for Joseph Smith...yeah it's not doing that thing anymore, nor is anyone doing that thing with the thing that makes this thing famous.  Unfortunately, this stone's usefulness just boils down to being a very pretty paperweight.  Other than the word of the Mormon leaders, we have nothing to go off of.  It's not being used today in any capacity, nobody alive saw Joseph Smith use this stone nor were there any pictures of Joseph using this thing at the time of translation.  Furthermore, since Joseph Smith was very vague in how he used it, we can't even try to recreate it's designed Mormon purpose.  The LDS church has presented this stone and shouted, "This is the thing we told you about!"  and I respond, "Ok.  Prove it."  The fact is they can't.  Even if this is the stone that was used, we would never know.  How do we know they didn't just go outside and grab the prettiest stone they could find?  We don't.

3. Witchcraft Origins

     I can feel you Mormons rolling your eyes at me right now.  But seriously, just listen for a second.  God did not give Joseph Smith these stones (he had multiple stones not just the one but reportedly eventually only used one of them during the translation process for convenience).  Mormon history reports that the seer stones, "which Joseph Smith discovered in the ground years before he retrieved the gold plates, was a small oval stone, or "seer stone."  As a young man during the 1820's, Joseph Smith, like others in his day, used a seer stone to look for lost objects and buried treasure."  Seer stones work by looking into them and receiving supernatural knowledge.  Now, I know the Lord works in mysterious ways and I am no where near qualified to say what He can or cannot use to communicate truth to His people...but are we supposed to believe that this was a gift from God?  Seriously?!?  I mean, if we believe that there are Holy powers at work, then logically there would have to be Evil powers at work as well.  And using a stone to look for buried treasure (regardless of how prevalent a practice it was) seems like dark magic...you know, the kind that the real life Voldemort uses.  And then, using said stone to start a religion shrouded in secrecy just seems very demonic to me.
     All Harry Potter jokes aside, the more and more I learn about the history of the LDS church and Joseph Smith, the more and more I am convinced that the Angel of Light truly did visit Joseph Smith that day.*

4. Drama, Drama, Drama, Drama, Drama, Drama, Drama, Drama....BATMAN!! 
(but seriously, something to think about)

     Of all the things that the LDS church could have produced as 'proof' they had to bring out one of the things that creates a bit of a dilemma for the LDS church.  You see, the story goes that Joseph Smith translated the Brass Plates - or Plates of Brass or the Golden Plates - into English, thus creating the Book of Mormon.  However, the story also goes that Joseph Smith stuck his head in a hat and with the use of this stone and the Urim and the Thummim scribed the Book of Mormon.  But you see, the plates couldn't have fit into the hat...so Joseph Smith was not reading and translating these plates but rather seeing visions of words and then reading them out so that his scribes could write it down.  Thus, bringing up the question: If Joseph Smith used the seer stone to "see" words and haven them written down, what was the point of getting the Golden Plates?

5.  It Proves Very Little, If Anything At All

     With everything I said in mind, this does little to nothing proving Mormonism is true.  Even if this thing is the thing that they are claiming this thing to be, it doesn't mean that the Book of Mormon, the D&C, or Mormonism in general along with it's countless errors and changes was a revelation from God.  I'm sorry to keep sounding like a broken record, but I need proof.  I need proof of use, proof of concept, proof of anything really. As I said, I love the fact that the church is trying to be more transparent, but this hurts their cause rather than helps because, for me, it only generates more confusion, more unanswered/dodged questions, and more scrutiny.  I watched a video interview (link below) of a Mormon History professor from Columbia University.  And while he was impressed with the stone, he didn't seem to get any more clarity from it either.
     I would be very interested to hear and would love to see an honest Mormon's reaction to the stone and even be proven wrong.  I would welcome it!  Honestly, I would.  However, with the facts in hand, at the end of the day, I don't see this stone as being any representation of truth, of divinity, or of the Holiness, Sovereignty, or the Power of God.

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Well, there you have it folks.  Hope you got something out of my little rant...ahem...I mean...blog.  As always, if you have any questions, concerns, or anything please leave a comment below or email me.  Also, sorry about the harshness of the images I used.  I try to be playful with such a serious topic, and I don't mean to poke fun.  Know that my heart is full of nothing but love for you Mormons.  However, this whole stone seemed to be a bit silly to me, hence the silliness of my picture accompaniments.

"Good day, sir!"


Footnotes
* The LDS account of the events surrounding the Angel Moroni have been changed, but the 1976 edition of D&C said that Joseph Smith was visited by Moroni, an "angel of light."  Compare with Testimony of Joseph Smith (3rd and 10th paragraph) to 2 Cor. 11:14.


References
1. The Book of Mormon Translation (www.lds.org) 8/11/2015
      - https://www.lds.org/topics/book-of-mormon-translation?lang=eng#27 

2. Trib Talk: Mormon Scholar Richard Bushman on seer stones, transparency, Jennifer Napier-Pearce 8/10/2015; The Salt Lake Tribune (www.sltrib.com)
     - http://www.sltrib.com/home/2814998-155/trib-talk-mormon-scholar-richard-bushman

3. Seer Stone (Latter Day Saints) Wikipedia
     - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seer_stone_(Latter_Day_Saints)

4.  Angel of Light, Michelle;  Life After.  
     - http://lifeafter.org/angel-of-light/

My Two Cents On My Two Cents

     So, I had a dear friend call me the other day.  This person is still a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and after reading a few of my blogs called for a bit of a heart to heart.  They had questions about why I even have a blog, what my goals in writing are, and had a few things to say that they felt, as a friend, I needed to hear.  I absolutely enjoyed talking to them and am very appreciative that they contacted me.  The strength to call and talk about sensitive issues with a person like me - not always having the level-ests of heads - was very amazing.  I am truly lucky to have a friend like them in my life.  If you are reading this, thank you so much for being an amazing person and being willing to want to talk to me and keep me honest.  Love you!
     After said conversation, I realized that maybe my friend's concerns were not isolated.  Maybe there are other people that wonder the same things my friend was.  So, I decided to try and highlight a few of the questions that my friend had raised and try to be as transparent as I can be, all the while honoring God in the process.

Why Are You Doing This?
     I felt a call a while ago to put my testimony in words.  I felt that my story was moving enough to maybe bring someone to the Great White Throne.  I shared it with a couple of people in my life and they seemed to enjoy it.  That, and a few other events in my life, led to me writing a book.  Again, I felt called to share my knowledge and experiences with whoever would listen.  I saw that a lot of people do not know what the Mormon Church teaches, and that includes Mormons themselves.  My book's intention was to communicate what I felt that God placed on my heart to say.  However, not everything I wanted to say was in the book, whether it didn't fit with the narrative or was more of a side note than a chapter.  That led to the creation of this blog.  I am enjoying the opportunity to share with the world what I think, however insignificant my opinion may be.  I wanted an outlet to be able to share little tidbits of doctrine, inspiration, findings, studies, thoughts, etc. in a way that would impact the world for Jesus.


We Get It.  You're Not Mormon Anymore.  Why Keep Writing?
     I think it should come as no surprise to anyone that I believe wholeheartedly that the doctrine taught by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a false one.  I believe the Church is actively leading people astray from the true message of Christ.  I have touched upon a few things in detail of what I mean by this.  However, with as much righteous anger I have towards Mormonism, my heart breaks and reaches out to its members.  As I've said, I have close friends and family that are caught up in this heretical gospel and I just want to see them in a fulfilling relationship with Jesus.  So, I write my dumb little thoughts and what-nots in the hopes that maybe one LDS member would read it and think about what they believe.  I hope that I would challenge them to dig deeper into the claims of Mormonism and ultimately develop a solid relationship in our Savior.  I also write stuff to reach those people who have loved ones that belong to the LDS faith.  They need to know what their loved ones are being taught so that they can better evangelize the true good news of Jesus' saving grace.  I do not, however, write because I am somehow nostalgic for my old faith, nor do I need to convince myself of its falsities.


Does It Really Matter What Church We Go To?
     Yes, and no.  I'll start with the negative.  It does not matter what church you attend or are a member of when it comes to salvation.  The Bible says that we are justified by faith alone through the blood of Jesus Christ.  I see no disclaimer anywhere that talks about where you park your car on Sunday mornings.  So, no it doesn't matter...for salvation.  On the other side of the coin, it does matter where you are being spiritually fed.  If you believe the Bible to be God's word, then you need to attend a church that teaches from it and holds it at the highest authority.  The LDS church unashamedly states that the Bible is not the final authority on spiritual issues, nor can it be fully trusted.


I Believe in Jesus, You Believe in Jesus... Who Cares If There Are A Few Differences Between Them.  It's All The Same Right?
     In my mind, logic would dictate that if God wrote it down then it must be important.  And even though the Bible does not spell out every tiny detail of Jesus' life, it does tell us quite a bit about who He was, what He did, who He hung out with, who His family was, what He said, and so on.  Some, but not all, of Jesus' traits or details I've listed below.

• Fulfilled God's promise to Abraham (Gal 3:8, Acts 3:25-26)
• Lineage of King David (Matt. 1:1)
• Born in Bethlehem (Matt. 2:1-6)
• Born of a virgin (Luke 1:35)
• Son of God (Luke 1:32, Rom. 1:3-4)
• He is God (John 1:1, Heb. 1:3)
• He is the Creator - not the created (John 1:10)
• Redeemed by His name only (John 14:6, Acts 4:12) 

Quite literally, the list goes on.  Jesus fulfilled hundreds of promises and prophecies and the Bible goes on and on and on about His deity, His authority, and His sovereignty.  Clearly, the Author and the writers of the Bible (God and the apostles/prophets, respectively) wanted you to know who Jesus was.  Furthermore, the Bible warns us of following a false Jesus.  "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect." (Matt. 24:24).  God warns us that people might pretend to be Jesus and stay away from them.  Or, more applicably, there may come a religion that will construct a Jesus that is not the one spoken of in God's word.  So, the Bible tells us not only describes Jesus a hundred different ways, but also warns us of false ones.  Sounds to me like it absolutely matters which Jesus we follow!
     If you've read my book or my blog, you would know that the Mormon Jesus is not the Biblical Jesus.  Mormons teach that Jesus was created, that Jesus is the brother of Satan, that Jesus is a God but not the God, and we are redeemed (or "saved") by Jesus AND our works.  The Book of Mormon even states in Alma 7:10 that Jesus was born in Jerusalem rather than Bethlehem.  So you see, these little nuances surrounding our Christ means we serve 2 different Persons.  As Dr. Martin once said in his sermons, "You have two conflicting doctrines.  You have the Apostles and you have Joseph Smith.  Make your choice."


We Both Believe that Jesus Died For Our Sins, And We Use Our Good Works To Show Jesus We Are Worthy of His Grace, Right?
     This is only a Mormon perspective, not a Christian one.  Or, in other words, this idea of working to show worthiness of grace is not Biblical.  This is a difference between looking inward and looking upward.  Mormons look inward.  They see that they need to prove their devotion to God.  They have to show God they are believers by getting baptized, paying their tithe, getting married in the temple, and other such ordinances.  In contrast, the Bible teaches that we are absolutely, without a doubt, 100% guilty of sin and deserving of hell (Rom. 6:23).  Even our good deeds are drenched in sin (Isaiah 64:6).  But, God is so good and "he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities" (Psalm 103:10).  We therefore act because God has saved us.  We show good fruit in gratitude and honor of the One who bares our sins.  We aren't 'good' to prove worthiness, we are 'good' because He has changed us and we act out of love to worship and honor Him.  It's a tiny difference, but an incredibly important distinction.
   

Why Do You Hate the Mormon Church?
     If I were to try and categorize my feelings towards the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I would hope that I am righteously angry with them.  You know, the type of anger that Jesus displayed when He was turning over tables in the temple for not honoring the Lord.  As I said, I see them as a false religion that are leading millions of people astray.  They have taken the good news of the gospel of Jesus Christ and twisted it so that it's close enough to sound Christian, but has no authority, no true good news, and ultimately no hope for eternal salvation.  They are the wolf in sheep's clothing, stalking those who are vulnerable or immature in their faith.  That angers me to no end, and I don't think that's wrong for me to say.  The Bible commands us to "judge correctly" (John 7:24) and to stand firm in the faith (1 Cor. 16:13).  I absolutely hate what the LDS church has done to my Jesus and His gospel.  That being said, I absolutely love, love, love, love it's members.  I have a great deal of respect for my Mormon friends and family members.  I pray for them often and would welcome a conversation with them any day of the week.  They are great, loving, caring, and honest people.  So, while I have strong feelings against the doctrines taught by the LDS church, my heart could not be more full of love and compassion for it's members.
     In life, there comes a time (regardless of religious affiliation) when people question what they are being taught.  Most people will examine evidences (sometimes in-depth) and decide whether or not they believe it.  I have noticed that if a person does not get some type of tangible proof behind their faith they might eventually walk away.  Even Christian churches have experienced a mass exodus of teens and young adults walking away from their faith because their pastors and leaders are not doing a good job of feeding them.  Sadly, these people are not being taught archaeological, logical, logistical, geographical, scientific, astrological evidences that substantiate the Bible as the word of God.  If the church would just speak up then this departure might be able to be minimized or even avoided.
     However, in the case of Mormonism, I found the facts to be few and far between.  There is not a whole lot of tangible evidences that can substantiate their claims.  We have no geographical evidences of any of the places in the Book of Mormon.  To date there have been no archaeological finds that point to any of the cities, wars, materials, peoples, crops, etc. talked about in the Book of Mormon.  We don't even have the original Plates of Brass that Joseph Smith found in the hill Cumorah.  So, when it comes to rooting a person's faith, all they can really rely on is their burning bosom testimony (their heart) which is not the best barometer.
     From my experiences, this lack of evidence eventually comes to the surface, dividing Mormons into three harmful categories.  The first category is the "All-ins."  They want to believe it so badly that they just grab and and won't let go.  They are the ones who will say to anyone, "I don't care what evidence you show me, what false prophecies you say that our prophets have done, or what Bible verses you can show me contradict our faith.  I believe Mormonism is correct and there is absolutely nothing you can say to change my mind!"  But, this is the exact definition of close mindedness and blind faith and should be avoided.  The second category are the "Whatevs."  These members just go along with it because it's safe and easy.  They like their friends or the activities they get to do and they are completely uninterested in examining their faith because they are complacent.  These people generally don't even know what they are supporting or really don't even care to know.  Lastly, there are the "Burned outs."  These are the people who have seen the ugliness that is Mormonism and instead of realizing there really is a God and that He loves them, they swear off believing in God completely.  They want nothing to do with Him in any form and might even become actively Atheistic in their lifestyles.  In my opinion all of these types come from the fact that Mormonism has so little evidences, weak teachings, and it's all based on a feeling.  It's the parable of the sower laid out for all to see.


Mormons Are Good People.  Why Hate On A Religion That is Helping People?
     If, in the end, it came down to who was a good person then maybe I'd change my tone.  But that is not what God teaches in His Bible.  The Bible basically spells out that we are all dirty, rotten, sinners in need of a savior and that it is only through the blood of Jesus that we can be saved.  Salvation is not a popularity contest.  I don't care if you are a good person or not.  I don't care if you give away all your money.  I don't care if your name is Mother Teresa or Mahatma Gandhi.  All I care about is that you have a relationship with the true and living God.  Does the Mormon church teach it's members to be kind, loving, generous, awesome people?  Absolutely!  Does the Mormon church teach it's members to love, honor, worship, praise, and glorify the true and living God?  In my opinion, take it or leave it, they absolutely do not!  I know this may be harsh, but this blog may be the only opportunity I have to speak to some Mormons, and I don't have time to beat around the bush.  You need the Biblical Jesus to save your soul...and you need Him badly.  We all do, myself included.

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     Well, I hope this means now that there is a little bit more understanding of where I'm coming from, why I do this, and how much I love you and Jesus.  If there is something that I didn't address or a question that you want me to answer, please comment below or shoot me an email at whereisjesusbook@gmail.com.  Thanks for reading!

Why Is Everyone Going Crazy About A Lion?

So, I had a thought.

     People are outraged at Dr. Walter Palmer for killing Cecil the Lion (pictured left) and other precious animals.  The internet is abuzz as people are lining up to protest this man.  I have seen his business ransacked with hate speech, picket signs and even death threats.  Furthermore, his family is being berated online as people are calling for "justice."  I'm reading the articles with hashtags like #CatLivesMatter, #JusticeForCecil, and other such tags that all cry out for this man to be accountable for his actions.  But in all honesty, if I'm really looking at everything objectively, I can't help but wonder why people are so upset.  Yes, you read that correctly, why are people so upset at this?  I mean, it's not like he did anything wrong, right?

Hear me out.

     Everybody knows that the Bible is just a made up book.  God didn't create us in His image.  From Genesis to Revelation, it is pure fantasy.  It's a glorified fairy tale.  Truth be told, every science book and smart guy out there will tell you that we originated from Darwinian evolution.  Our entire earth is a product of the Big Bang Theory and are a result of billions of years of micro to macro evolution.  We owe our existence to phenomena like natural selection, genetic mutation, cosmological happenstance, and borderline blind luck.  Right?  I mean, this is what we are taught to believe, isn't it?  For me at least, it seems that everyone knows we evolved from a common ancestor, that there is no Creator, and more importantly there is no God!
     Well, since everyone knows this "truth" then why is everyone up in arms about some guy killing Cecil?  If we are taking an honest look at things, why does it matter?  As I said, there is no higher power, so that means there is no higher law as we are all products of naturalism.  Right and wrong are societal constructs rather than objective ideas.

"nature is not cruel, only pitiless indifferent.  This is one of the hardest lessons for humans to learn.  We cannot admit that things might be neither good nor evil, neither cruel nor kind, but simply callous - indifferent to all suffering, lacking all purpose." 

- Richard Dawkins 

River Out of Eden: A Darwinian View of Life

pg. 95-96

     Richard Dawkins says that whatever nature does, it is not evil, nor cruel, nor malice intent.  This is because in nature, there is no right and wrong.  Only calloused actions.  Does a lion feel guilt for killing a zebra?  Not at all.  Does a bird feel wrong when it kills a fish?  Nope.  Does a goat feel bad for killing a snake that is threatening to attack?  I highly doubt it.  You see, in the animal kingdom there is only one rule: kill or be killed.  It is survival of the fittest.  

     Now, I can hear some of you saying that all of these instances are for food or for protection so they are not solid arguments.  Fair enough.  But what about rape?  I think we can all agree that rape is wrong.  However, the animal kingdom is littered with examples of rape.  What about incest?  Tons of examples as well.  What about child abuse, incest, neglect, murder, violence?  Yup, yup, and yes.  I can quote examples of all of these several times over.  But these 'wrongs' are not perceived as such within nature.  What's my point?  My point is that nature has no good or evil, no right and wrong.  It lacks all purpose.

     Realistically, we do have objective morality.  For instance, everyone can agree that the Holocaust was a horrible thing.  We know it was wrong and will always know it is wrong.  Even if the Germans had won WWII and changed the history books to say that they did humanity a favor, we would still know that it was wrong.  Same thing with sexual abuse towards children.  Nobody needs to be told that doing such heinous acts with a child is wrong.  However, within the views of Naturalism (the idea or belief that only natural - as opposed to supernatural or spiritual - laws and forces operate in the world) and Darwinian evolution these "evils" are non-existent.  To date, these theories have yet to properly explain why there does exist an objective morality (absolute good and evil).  

"On the face of it, the Darwinian idea that evolution is driven by natural selection seems ill-suited to explain such goodness as we possess, or our feelings of morality, decency, empathy, and pity.  Natural selection can easily explain hunger, fear, and sexual lust, all of which straightforwardly contribute to our survival or the preservation of our genes."

- Richard Dawkins

The God Delusion

pg. 245-46

     So, what am I saying?  I'm saying that if the 'popular' view of life's origins are correct, and we are all here just because of a perfect storm of gravity, thermodynamics, genetics, cosmology, astrology, geology, etc. then why does it matter if one creature kills another?  Dawkins states there is no clear rhyme or reason for us to even distinguish right and wrong.  Therefore, Dr. Palmer was just asserting his dominance as the dominant species.  Humans are on top and he was just expressing this fact by killing the King of the Jungle.  Logically, there is absolutely no reason to make a big deal out of this.  It should be as innocent as killing a fly.  Killing a lion, regardless of where it was and how he did it, is meaningless.  It's just survival of the fittest.  

     To further illustrate my point, lets just assume that Dr. Walter Palmer missed the shot and instead the lion killed him.  Do you think the outcry would be the same?  Or do you think the internet would say, "Poacher was a bad shot and got what was coming to him."  I doubt this story would have made such an uproar then.  Why?  Because a lion killing someone out in the Safari is just an example of a lion doing what lions do best.  We would not expect a lion to think and rationalize that this man has kids, a wife, a job, and/or responsibilities.  Do you see where I'm getting at?

     The simple fact that we have such an amazing outcry for justice in a way is a powerful argument towards Intelligent Design and the authority of God.  I am a God fearing Christian, and I believe we are held to a higher standard.  We are created in His image and are purposely, wonderfully, and fearfully made by Him.  It is because of His imprint on all our lives that we have objective moralities.  It is because of His son, who died on the cross for our sins that we have the opportunity to repent of our rebellion to Him, be forgiven, and walk with Him in paradise.

     So, if you are a Naturalist (like Richard Dawkins) or one of those people that do not believe in God, do not believe the Bible, and/or do not think that we were Intelligently designed by a higher power then I don't think you have a leg to stand on.  Stop harassing a man who did absolutely nothing wrong...because in all honesty, what is wrong anyways?

Notes:

For further insight, please read Dr. McDowell and Jonathan Morrow's book Is God Just a Human Invention, Chapter 15 Can People Be Good without God.  

A Burning Bosom

     A few years ago, I conducted a survey of every and any LDS member that I could find.  I designed the survey so that any presuppositions that I had could be clarified so that my book would be more accurate.  Of the questions I had, one of them was in regards to the Holy Spirit's testifying power, or the "burning bosom."

Have you received a "burning bosom" regarding the validity of the LDS church, the LDS prophets, and/or the LDS scriptures?

The survey then allowed for members to rate how much their testimony depended on that feeling based on a scale from 1 to 10, with 1 being low and 10 being high.  Of the people I surveyed, numbers from 8 to 10 were selected, with an average value of 9.18.  This tells me that Mormons rely heavily on this burning bosom experience.  Meaning, had they not received this burning in their bosom they might not be members of the LDS church today.  But what exactly is a burning bosom? Furthermore, should anyone rely so heavily upon it?

"But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.  But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings..." -Doctrine and Covenants 9:8-9a

     LDS Missionaries tell investigators all the time to pray and ask God if the Book of Mormon is true, for instance.  They say that the Bible states, "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him." (James 1:5).  Coupled with the scripture from D&C Section 9, Mormons claim that if one were to ask God earnestly about something - say the validity of the Book of Mormon - He would answer them with a "burning bosom."  From what I understand and was taught, a burning bosom refers to the warming in your soul, a peace in your gut, and/or a strong feeling that you get when asking God a question.  And, as I said earlier, this burning bosom experience plays a crucial role in solidifying a Mormon's faith.  And, even though my survey was taken from a small sample group, I would be willing to bet that if you were to ask an LDS member the same question, you would get a very similar response.  Try it yourself the next time you are with your friends and comment what they respond below.  I'd love to hear your findings.
     Believe it or not, I actually had a burning bosom experience when I was younger and it changed my world completely.  I was around 13 years old and I was really struggling with a personal matter.  I was broken hearted, beaten down, guilt ridden, and seeking advice.  I dropped to my knees and prayed for forgiveness and answers.  I begged and pleaded with God to guide me in my life and provide me some answers.  After my tear filled prayer, I picked up my Book of Mormon and turned it to no specific page and started to read.  Amazingly, what I needed to hear was right there in front of me.  Unfortunately, being so long ago I don't remember exactly what I read, but I do remember knowing that I had just received exactly what I prayed for.  I knew God had answered my prayer!  This not only proved to me His existence but also the validity of the Book of Mormon as well.  That experience completely strengthened my faith.  From that day on, no matter what life threw at me, I knew God loved me and that Mormonism was true.
     However, as you can tell by this blog, my book, the church I go to, and basically everything that I now stand for that my burning bosom testimony didn't last.  It was when I started researching Mormonism and really objectively looking at the facts, the realities of Mormonism and their doctrine that my burning bosom was soothed.  I believe this happened because, as the Bible says, you cannot trust your heart.

     The truth is we are all too often deceived by our hearts.  Remember when you were a teenager and you had a crush on that special someone?  I do.  I couldn't stop thinking about her.  I was head over heels in love with her and nothing else seemed to matter.  Every time I saw her, my heart fluttered, my palms got sweaty, and I knew that she was the one for me and even thought about future marriage plans.  However, now being older and wiser I recognize that it wasn't love, it was infatuation.  My heart blinded me to the truth.  Had I acted on that urge, that testimony of undying love, my life would not be where it is today and for that I'm grateful.
     Still not sure the heart is untrustworthy?  Think back to when you were in school, taking a multiple choice test.  Do you remember getting to a question that you absolutely had no idea which answer was correct so you just went with your gut feeling?  I did this several times throughout my high school and college careers.  You want to know what I learned?  My gut is not as smart as I would like it to be.  Even if I felt like a certain answer made the most sense, or got a good feeling about it, the reality was it was never always correct.
     Still need more convincing to question your heart?  Well, lets talk about relativism.  Relativism is the idea that what is right for you is correct, and what is right for me is correct.  Yours and my truths may not coincide with one another, but they still both remain completely true.  People use this all the time when talking about religion.  "You believe in God, and that's fine for you.  Go for it!  As for me, I don't believe God exists.  But, that's my truth.  You have yours and I have mine."  These people feel in their hearts that as long as a person is at peace with their path, then it is the right one.  When pressed about this subject, they say, "It just feels right."  Truth for these people are relative and not at all absolute.
     But real "truth" doesn't work like that.  Real truth is not about a feeling, or about my opinion, or about your desires.  It is about hard evidence; it's about facts.  That is partly why I enjoy mathematics so much.  Truth, or a solution, or the correct answer, is set in stone.  2 + 2 = 4 no matter how you cut it (unless of course you are not using base 10, or if using modular math...but I digress).  Gravity always pulls you towards it.  Real truth is not based on a feeling, nor is it defined by the heart.  As such, basing your faith solely on a burning bosom experience is dangerous.

     One of the problems with the Burning Bosom Theory is that it is inconclusive.  Countless Mormons have told me that if I would follow the advice of the Apostle James and pray on whether or not the Book of Mormon is true, then God would grant me an answer.  They say that they did it and received a burning sensation that proved to them beyond a shadow of a doubt that book is indeed true.  But, I have prayed about it...several times.  And I can honestly say that I absolutely know that the Book of Mormon is a lie, preaches false doctrine, and is heretical in nature.  So, if Person A gets one answer from God and Person B does the same thing and receives the complete opposite answer, then the method cannot be completely trusted.  (Let me be clear on something.  I am not saying that the Holy Spirit cannot be trusted.  I know it sounds like I'm speaking out of both sides of my mouth on this one but I am not.  We can trust an answer from God, but we cannot always trust that every answer we get is from God.  We need to be smart about who we are listening to.)  Mormons, of course, have an answer to this conundrum.  "You obviously didn't pray about it the right way."  They say if I did do it right then I wouldn't have gotten the wrong number.  The problem must lie with me because the right answer wasn't given to me.  But wait a second!  It's only right if I get your answer?  Seems a bit sketchy to me.  

     To this I have two comments:  1)  Who are you to say that my heart wasn't in the right place?  If I tell you that I honestly prayed about it and got a different answer, who are you to tell me otherwise?  2)  How do you know that the answer you received was the right one in the first place?  If it is a possibility that my heart was in the wrong place (i.e. - I already decided that Mormonism was false) then by that same standard couldn't your heart also be in the wrong place as well (i.e. - already deciding or wanting Mormonism to be true)?  I think that some people really want the LDS church to be true, whether for family reasons, a girl they are seeing, a boy they like, a social benefit, a yearning to belong somewhere, etc.  Some can get emotionally involved and euphorically come to the conclusion that what they are reading, or what they are doing, or what they believe is true.  This is not a good way to do it.  

     Furthermore, it is absolutely possible to make yourself feel good about doing something wrong if you really want it to be right.  Men who commit adultery have convinced themselves that their spouse is wrong and that they deserve to be happy.  People rationalize that doing drugs makes them feel good, so it can't be bad.  So, if this is all possible, isn't it then plausible that a person could really want to believe a certain religion is true and then give themselves a burning bosom, or at least think they've received it?  I think it is.  But as we've just learned, a feeling is not always a good barometer for truth.  All I'm trying to say is that the burning of the bosom should not be the foundation of a person's faith.  It should be coupled with study, prayer, and intellectual findings.  I fear that most Mormons' faith depend solely or greatly on that feeling.

     Friends, God can, will, and does give you answers.  God can testify to your soul.  God can and will answer you when you ask Him.  Our God is so relationally focused that He wants to provide you with answers so that you can better honor, serve, and love Him.  The thing is, He also gave us a fully functional brain that He expects us to use.  I fully believe that God wants us to think, study, test, and research everything for ourselves.  The truth is out there, and He is more than willing to guide our steps.  Do we need to pray for answers? Yes.  Do we need to submit our lives to His guidance? Absolutely!  I am not at all saying to not include God in this matter.  I'm not even saying that God cannot give you a peace about something true.  Far from it!  However, my faith is not solely based on a feeling I got when I needed help.  That may be part of it, but not all of it.  It is true that my beliefs are founded upon a relationship with an unseen God.  Though I have witnessed His hand in my life and felt His presence, I have not literally seen Him and so a bit of faith is required.  But I have also researched and discovered axioms that solidify my faith.  Along with my 'gut' I have logical conclusions, historical documents, archaeological finds, moral understandings, and even mathematical equations that give me a well rounded, solid faith that God is absolutely real and that Jesus is my savior.

Dear Chandler

Chandler Roberson is a fairly well known blogger.  Her site, DaysOfChandler.com, seems to be geared more towards women as most of her posts are about fashion.  So, if you ever want to know how to dress modestly, or get a specific hair look, she might be able to help you out.  I don't even know what I'm saying right now!  Ha ha ha.  However, on July 16th, 2015 she posted a blog entitled I Believe, which is something I can talk about with some - albeit little - degree of intelligence.

After reading her post, I was impressed to do more than just 'like' or 'share.'  I also felt that I needed to do more than just leave a comment on her page, even though I did do that.  I wanted to do a bit more.  So I thought I'd write her a letter and hope that it finds her.    

So, Ms. Roberson, this is for you.

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Dear Chandler,

     A good friend of mine posted a link to your blog I Believe and after reading only the first few sentences I was immediately hooked.  Not only do I love reading personal, heartfelt expressions of faith, but the fact that you are a practicing Mormon was even more enticing.  I too struggled with my LDS faith and that struggle led me to the throne of Jesus and leaving the Mormon faith altogether.  I, therefore, am always eager to hear/read stories of other members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints who are going through choppy waters.  I want to know what they found out, what they did to overcome whatever it was, and whether or not their faith was strengthened or weakened by their experiences.  Your story was no different and I feel privileged to have read it.  So, thank you for sharing.  

     I was intrigued by your story about your friend leaving the LDS Church.  I too had people I was close to and admired question and leave the faith.  Likewise, my faith was rattled.  I can't tell you how glad I was to read when you said, "I wasn't ready to go down without a fight.  I prayed.  I read.  I called some of the most spiritual people I know.  I thought of some of the most spiritual people I know."  I so love that!  You didn't just fall on your parents' opinions, nor your friends'.  You used that brain of yours and looked at it from several different angles.  Bravo!  Too many people don't take the time to investigate their own beliefs and they should!

     I hope everyone reading your blog knows and understands how much courage that takes.  I would assume from your writings that you are a faithful member and are most likely deeply rooted into the LDS church.  To take an honest look at things from the inside is a BIG deal.  And to that I commend you Ms. Chandler, and encourage you to not lose that drive!

     However, I was very saddened by your next paragraph.  Truth be told, I was anxiously waiting to hear what you learned, how God opened your eyes (either in favor of or against) regarding the Church.  I wanted to hear God's love and wisdom shine down on you and give you the type of clarity that even LensCrafters can't provide.  But you didn't.  I don't know if that is because what you learned was private or that you were unable to find anything at all.  Either way, I would be very interested to know the fruits of your labors should you decide to write another blog on the subject.  Unfortunately, the only thing you provided was:

     "If God didn't exist, then I would continue doing exactly what I am doing.  Why?  Because when lived fully and earnestly, it will make me the best person I can be.  Loving, caring, serving, hoping.  I would much rather believe in something than believe in nothing."

     I have to ask - and forgive me for being so bold - but, where are your principals?  Where is your integrity?  Why would you stay and cling to a faith that you discovered to be wrong?  Why would you choose to raise your current/future family in a church that may be build on a lie?  Just staying in a church because it makes you a better person is not a valid reason.  For there are 'good' Muslims, Scientologists, Atheists, Christians, Mormons, and Budhists.  This is why the Apostle Paul nips this argument in the bud when quotes Isaiah and says that we as a whole human race are not good people (Romans 3:10).

     The heart of our issue is not whether we are a 'good' person.  The problem is sin.  Everyone does it and everyone is guilty of it (Romans 3:23).  However, God chose to came down and shower us with His unfailing grace  (John 1:14) so that we do not have to endure the eternal consequences of that sin (Matt. 1:21, Rom. 5:8, 1 John 1:9).  This gift of eternal salvation is given to us all freely (Eph :8-9) and is found only through the blood of of our savior, Jesus (John 14:6).

     Furthermore, we don't go to church - or shouldn't go to church - because we want to be a better person.  Church isn't about us.  It's about God.  We should go to church wanting to know more about Him and His will in our lives.  We should go to church because it is a set apart time we make to just sit and worship Him.  We should go to church so that we can, as a body of believers, sharpen each other so that we can be used better by God.  It is a difference of looking inward (what you described) and looking upward (what I described).  

   

     "Either the gospel is true or it's not.  I believe it is. ...The way I see it though is if God exists, this is his church."  

     I do hope you know that Mormonism isn't the only 'gospel' out there.  In fact, the gospel I just referenced above is fundamentally different than the gospel that Mormonism teaches.  This is not an attack, but an observation of LDS history.  Joseph Smith reported that God told him that all the professing churches were false, their doctrines were wrong, and their pastors were corrupt, thus needing Joseph to "restore" the gospel.  Joseph Smith started a religion that was different than the other Bible believing churches.  You are correct when you said "Either the gospel is true or it is not."  However, I need you to know that the good news of Jesus Christ can be true AND the LDS church be wrong.

     "I don't care what mistakes were made by members in LDS history anymore.  They are only human.  And of course it's going to look bad when you compile every poor choice they made into a single document.  I sure would hate if someone did that to me, you would probably hate me too!"  

     People are sinners and we all make mistakes, myself included.  However, there is a big difference between a member making a mistake, and a person claiming to speak for God (One who NEVER makes a mistake) making a mistake.  If a person claims to be speaking for or on behalf of God (i.e. - "Thus saith the Lord") then that person cannot make a mistake since that would mean that God made a mistake...which He doesn't do!  Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and all the other prophets claimed to speak for God (as they claimed to be Prophets of God).  Therefore, you absolutely should care when these guys made a mistake.

     "And I have a hard time believing in "facts" because facts seem to always change.  The earth was flat, Pangea never existed.  Faith in religion is rarely factual, but that's exactly the purpose of faith."

      There is a difference between a fact and a theory.  People theorized that the earth was flat, that Pangea never existed, etc.  Just because it is presented as "fact" doesn't make it so.  And so while our faith is based on something that is intangible, God has given us axioms that we can hold to so that our faith isn't just based on a feeling, or a hope.  We found original manuscripts of the Bible, and the dead sea scrolls so we know our Bible has validity.  We can visit places like Jerusalem, Bethlehem, the River Jordan, the Dead Sea, and other Biblical cities and sites.  In fact, if you go to these places, a lot of people (dare I say almost all of them) would tell you that the "evidence" of the person of Jesus is so overwhelming that you would have to be crazy not to believe He was real.  Not to mention extra-Biblical sources that tell of a person named Jesus who died on a cross and claimed to be the Christ or Messiah.  The point is, we may not be able to prove our faith 100%, but we can make a very strong argument to believe it.

     "...being a faithful member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints will do nothing but persuade me to do good continually, it gives me such comfort.  Comfort that no "evidence" can take away."

     I love your resolve, but I fear that it is found "on rocky places, where it [does] not have much soil.  It [springs] up quickly, because the soil [is] shallow.  But when the sun [comes] up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they [have] no root"  (Mat 13:5-6).  A lot of my friends have made similar claims; that no matter what 'evidence' there was against the Mormon church, they would believe it to be true.  Can I just be honest with you and caution you against this type of thinking?  I hope you can see how closed off you are to letting the Holy Spirit guide you.  If you only hear what you think is best, how can the Holy Spirit work within you?

     I also hope you see that you are arguing in circles.  On one hand you say that you don't believe facts, or evidences should alter your faith.  But then you state that Joseph Smith was handed the plates of brass from God and translated it into the book of Mormon.  You claim that God has a plan for us, that God exists, and that basically Mormonism is true.  In fact, you testify to it.  But you cannot claim to distrust facts and then make unsubstantiated claims and present them as facts.  These are two opposing views.

     As I look back over my words, I realize that I might sound very harsh.  Just know that everything I said is out of love.  I don't know if our paths will ever cross and if this is the only thing I will ever say to you, I would rather it be a little bold yet founded in Biblical truth and authority than beat around the bush and have you miss what I believe you need to hear.  God loves you so much!  You are a wonderful person, made in His image, and he doesn't want you to just be a good person.  He doesn't want you to just live a decent life.  He came to give you life to the fullest (John 10:10) and that can only be found if you have a relationship with Jesus Christ.  

     Sister Chandler, I hope my words have not fallen on deaf ears.  I would encourage you to keep searching and looking for truth, not for your well being, but for God's glory.  Be strong enough to look at everything with an open mind and trusting that God will make your path straight (Prov. 3:5-6).  Don't ever be afraid of reading things that challenge your faith.  If you examine a piece of doctrine and it's false then you know what to stay away from and your faith is strengthened.  If you examine a piece of doctrine and you know it's true, then your faith is still strengthened.  It's a can't lose!  

     I will pray for you.  May God grant you wisdom in the years to come so that you may know Him better.  Thank you again for sharing your story and your testimony.  Have a blessed day.

In Christ,

-Brenton

Can Mormons Drink Coke?

An illustration of when the beloved LDS Prophet
received revelation regarding the Word of Wisdom.

     Mormons are not really known for their dietary scriptures.  In fact I would be willing to bet that unless you have ties to the LDS church, all you know is that Mormons don't drink coffee or alcohol.  So it may (or may not) surprise you to know that Mormons are supposed to follow a somewhat strict set of dietary rules called "The Word of Wisdom."  Now, the actual doctrine can be found in the Doctrine and Covenants Section 89, along with an overview of how it came about.  Even though I will highlight what it says, feel free to check my source and see for yourself.

No Alcohol 
(D&C 89:5-7)

     Mormons are not to drink any wine or strong drink, which includes hard liquor and beer.  The prophet further declared that the only use for alcohol is to wash your bodies.  So, if you are a Mormon and you use those hand sanitizing things, you're fine.  However, don't drink it.  Not only would it literally kill you - seriously, it's a different type of alcohol, don't do it - but Joseph Smith said not to put it in your belly.

No Tobacco 
(D&C 89:9)

     Smoking is banned...no surprise here.  This revelation was later understood to caution against the use of any illegal drugs and the misuse of prescription drugs.  While not explicitly written in the revelation, church officials believe the overall intent was to imply the sanctity of the body and prevent the induction of harmful chemicals into the body.  However, though you can't consume tobacco is can be used to help sick livestock.

No Hot Drinks 
(D&C 89:9)

     This is the verse that most closely relates to coffee and, believe it or not, Coca-Cola.  It says that they are not to consume "hot drinks."  Most Mormons hold that his verse is talking about coffee or tea, since it is primarily consumed while 'hot'.  But is it really that any drink that is above say 90 degrees off limits?  What if we just let it sit and get to room temperature?  Can we drink it then?  What about iced coffee?  Sweet ice-tea? How about a nice cup of hot chocolate on Christmas day?  Now, I know many members who won't even look at a cup of coffee, but still they drink hot chocolate.  Where is the line then?  I was always taught that the reason Joseph Smith banned coffee or tea was because of the caffeine.  Therefore since the reason behind the revelation was believed and taught to prevent the consumption of addicting substances (like caffeine) it then morphed and spread to the consumption of soda, even though no person in their right mind would ever drink a hot soda.  However, this is all conjecture.  Therefore, the answer to the title question "Can Mormons drink coke?" is an absolute and definite "maybe."

Fruits and Herbs are Good 
(D&C 89:10-11)

     Mormons can eat fruits and herbs out there, which includes vegetables.  However, it says all "wholesome" herbs are good.  It does not say all herbs are good.  There is a difference!  The prophet's revelation says you're safe as long as you are thinking about what you are eating and harvesting them in season.

Eat Meat...Just Not A Lot 
(D&C 89:12-13)

     This is the one that, as far as I could see, was NEVER followed.  I think most Mormons, when asked, would say they do follow this and would claim to eat it sparingly.  However, members place their own definition on the word 'sparingly.'  The passage then goes on to clarify what it means to eat meat sparingly.  It continues to direct members to only eat meat in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.  Pretty sure the answer would be a lot different if you defined sparingly as the LDS scriptures do.  I personally never followed this part of the Word of Wisdom when I was Mormon.  In fact, none of my friends did, and as far as I know/see none of my current LDS friends do nor any of my LDS family members.  So...yeah....

Whole Grains
(D&C 89:14-17)

     There are no restrictions to eating grains.  In fact it's quite the opposite.  Wheat and grains are to be the main staple of the human diet, along with fruits and herbs (and the implied vegetables).  So, no going on the Atkins diet if you are LDS.  

Benefits (D&C 89:18-21)

     God is supposed to have said that if one was to adhere to all of these rules, they would receive "health in their naval and marrow to their bones" as well as gaining spiritual knowledge.  The LDS then quotes the prophet Isaiah as further promised prosperity.  "...and shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint."  (c.f.  Isaiah 40:31).  They then reference the Passover story by saying that "...the destroying angel shall pass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen." 

My Two Cents
     I have nothing against dietary rules.  Promoting living healthily is a good thing.  I too believe your body is a gift from God and that you should take care of it.  Since nowhere in this passage is salvation even mentioned, these rules are not meant to save but to sanctify.  And that is totally cool.  I don't even have a problem with the LDS church making adherence to these sets of rules a requirement for admittance into their temple.  Well, that's not true.  I have a bit of an issue regarding that but nothing I'd write a blog about or anything.  Well...maybe later.
     As you may or may not know, Mormonism teaches that following these rules is a requirement to gain entrance into their temples, a place that is extremely sacred and secret.  This means that they are not suggestions, but rather commands from God.  Yet, as I've said earlier, some of these rules are simply glossed over, and not the ones that are slightly obscure either.  Church officials will refuse a recommend if a member smokes or drinks, but not if they eat meat everyday, or are on a low-carb diet, or drink tea (my dad is English and loved to drink tea and he had one), or are even overweight for that matter.  This picking and choosing of which laws they should follow is an example of weak theological practice.  I mean, if you have a set of rules given to you by a prophet of God then you should follow those rules wholeheartedly.  If God really did tell Joseph to tell his people to follow this law, then it needs to be followed all the way.  The simple fact is that it isn't.
     It's just baffling to me to have a set of laws that are clearly important and yet clearly being bypassed and ignored, and yet still being something that Mormons swear by!  They hypocrisy of it all is pretty frustrating.  I have friends that will not drink, smoke, or get Starbucks but yet they will come to my BBQ, drink soda and not bat an eye.  It's...just...weird.

The Do's and Don'ts of Evangelizing to Mormons

     I've had a lot of people come up to me throughout the years and ask me a lot of different things regarding the LDS church.  But no matter what questions they have, they always seem to want to know how to actually put their knowledge into practice.  "How can I reach my Mormon friend?"  or "What can I say to these missionaries that come to my door?"  I spoke at a youth group a while back and one of the young men asked me, "What would you recommend to someone like me to do when evangelizing to my Mormon friends."  It's funny, you can have all the information in the world but without the know-how of how to communicate it effectively and lovingly to someone else evangelism can be a problem.

     So, I came up with a few do's and don'ts from my experiences in trying to evangelize to my friends and family.  Hopefully, you can learn from my mistakes, benefit from my successes, and ultimately prepare you to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit as you try to bring truth to our LDS friends.

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DON"T:  Just Memorize Verses

     Hear me out on this.  Just memorizing verses can be problematic when it comes to evangelizing to Mormons.  I am NOT saying to never memorize verses because having verses on your heart is a great way to be mindful of God.  However, when it comes to evangelizing to the LDS members, just knowing the verse may not be enough.  Your friend knows the verses, they learned them in high school seminary.  They might even be able to quote more verses than you.    

DO:  Understand Context Surrounding Those Verses

     Have you ever heard an atheist quote the Bible?  They always seem to pull out some Leviticus law verse out of context and spin it to promote their agenda, all the while chastising people for believing in such a crazy book.  However, even an elementary school kid with a basic understanding of the Bible can refute these weak arguments because they are taken out of context.  Context is key.  Learn the verses in context of scripture.  What period are you in?  Who is speaking?  What did the previous three chapters talk about?  Know your Bible.  It'll go a long way.

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DON'T:  Bash Their Books, Prophets, or Practices

     A good rule of thumb is to put yourself in their shoes before you speak.  Lets say that Greek mythology missionaries came to your door and they wanted to share with you a message.  Would you even be open to their message if they started off by telling you that you're wrong?  What about if they said that what your parents taught you and raised you on is in direct opposition to God?  That your Bible is a joke?  That your moral compass is flawed?  That your family has been deceived all these years?  Of course not!  We'd slam the door so fast in their face that they wouldn't know what hit them.  If it wouldn't work for you, then it probably isn't going to work for them.

DO:  Listen

     It's amazing what doors open up when you actually care about the other person and what they have to say.  If your friend comes up to you and wants to share something with you about their faith then let them!  Pay attention to what they are saying.  This will not only make them feel comfortable and appreciated but will also increase your chances of them listening to what you have to say in response.  Conversations are a two way street.  If you let them speak, then they'll return the favor.

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DON'T:  "I heard you believe ________"

     Nobody likes being told what they believe.  Even if you are quoting directly from an LDS publication, this type of argument tends to put the defensive walls up pretty fast.  Once they're up, your friend will be less willing to hear what you wanted to say.

DO:  "What do you believe in regards to __________?"

     Instead of telling them what they believe you are now giving them the opportunity to share something they feel passionate about with you.  People love to talk about what moves them, what they love, or what excites them.  Use this to strike up a conversation.  "Hey John!  I was at church the other day and I saw a few people getting baptized.  What do you think about baptism?"  Even if you think you know how their going to answer, it's always a good idea to know your audience and see where their stance is on things.  

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DON'T:  Get Conversationally Distracted

     I've had it happen a bunch of times.  I start talking to my friend about a certain topic.  We're really getting to some meat and potatoes of the discussion and things are starting to develop.  Then my friend will say something like "Well what about ______" or "Well, why don't you believe in ______" and bring in new topics.  Do not take the bait!  Trust me.  You will never get back to your original topic and you will have lost your train of thought either partially or entirely.

DO:  Stay Focused

     If and when your friend tries to steer the conversation in another direction, just respond with, "Let's stay on this topic for a little bit longer if you don't mind.  I'd love to discuss that with you as well, but just maybe when we've finished with this one first."  Stay on point.  It might get a little uncomfortable for both of you, but just press on with love and joy.

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DON'T:  Be Afraid to Decline or Defer

     If your friend is talking about a subject that you are unsure about or just not very prepared to discuss, don't feel like you have to say something.  While the Holy Spirit can guide you (and if He's doing so, then go with it!) sometimes it's okay to ask if it's okay to get back to them when you've studied a bit more.  Or, you could have them talk to a pastor, read a book or a blog (hint hint) and then talk about it with them later.  It's okay to not have all the answers.  Don't feel like if you don't say something now then you'll have lost your chance.

DO:  Speak In Love

     While it pains me to say it, Mormons are lost.  Their doctrine is a perversion of the gospel of Jesus Christ.  However, that is not your friends fault.  They are simply deceived.  Don't attack them as if they were the ones who found the plates of brass on the hill.  Instead, treat them as a lost sheep taken captive by the Deceiver.  Pray for wisdom on how to shine His light in their life and get them to have a relationship with the one, true God.

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DON'T:  Be Afraid to Pray

     Mormons pray, and often.  So, don't be afraid to start the conversation out with one!  Maybe even suggest that you both say one.  Remember that change is not possible without His intervention and there is no better way to invoke change than to invite Him to be present!  If the situation allows for it, ask if you can start your time off with a word of prayer.  Ask God to guide your conversation and open up hearts and break down barriers so that you both can hear Him speaking into your lives.  

DO:  Be THAT Friend

     After your conversation with your friend, be in prayer for them.  Pray that what God moved you to say would echo in their hearts.  Then, after a short time (maybe a week or so) you call your friend and take them out to lunch.  Ask them if they've given any more thought into what you talked about.  A follow up isn't just a tactic, but it's a way to build a friendship.  It lets the other person know that you care about them.  Ask if there is anything that you can pray for on their behalf.  Be THAT friend who is constantly thinking of them, constantly praying for them, constantly in the Word, and consistently available.